It jobs netherlands reddit. Im non eu student and no luck finding part time jobs.


  • It jobs netherlands reddit If Serh McFarlane hasn't written this into the show he needs to do it NOW "Lois, I'm moving to The Netherlands, specifically to a cold rainy seaside town in the middle of winter where there are literally zero tourists and the locals never leave their houses. Internships are extremely difficult to find even for Dutch people, so honestly if you’re an international applying for a Dutch internship, you don’t really have a chance, unless you speak fluent Dutch. There are "short" jobs in the sense that you could stay 1-2 years. Best websites for finding student housing in the Netherlands: Kamernet (biggest offering) . In the netherlands most of the schools are part of a big 'stichting' (foundation) this means that in practice having a fulltime job means that you have to teach at multiple schools daily. Or check it out in the app stores Amsterdam, Mokum, the capital of the Netherlands. Thank You, that was very insightful, I'm (Non - EU) currently pursuing a B. Sincerely, old. I am currently in the final stages of my master Medical Biotechnology and was wondering what the job scene is in the Netherlands? Is a PhD needed to get a good job or to rise the ranks in a company? Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. I am regularly applying for some top visa sponsoring Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. The lack of notice from Reddit, exorbitant pricing and terrible official apps are unacceptable The jobs that don't require Dutch require working experience of a couple years. Hey guys. Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. Also, I would need a minimum salary to continue staying in the Netherlands after my search year is over. This is your one-stop-shop for discussions, news, events, and local happenings in this sunny Southern California region. Companies in the Netherlands generally wants someone who speaks Dutch (for culture and especially for legal/ethics documents). Old. I would really appreciate the input of anyone who knows about this. Sort by: Best. Can you suggest me any job portal or any other website which can be useful to land up a job in Netherlands, and how much they provide visa sponsorship? Thanks Get yourself a good LinkedIn and start googling the companies around 'Chemelot'. If you need further guidance, PM me. I started my firs project on github and I am looking forward to creating more of them (idk how complex they have to be to get a job) Well, I was thinking about my future, getting a job after finishing 2nd and 3rd year and moving to another country. Large corporations in the Netherlands can be zero stress. With a . in fact, a lot of jobs i saw pay less in salary than my bonus. My husband will be graduating next year with 2 years of experience, and I'm curious if he can land a well-paying job (English-only). Outside of your job people speak Dutch. Netherlands seems really nice, organised country. if you have an office day job, they will probably not allow you But honestly best way is to go to linkedin and apply for jobs. Utlimate guide to finding student housing in the Netherlands Besides that, some jobs requires you to speak English. On a side note is it easier to get into PhD programs in the As in, yes, don’t apply for jobs which are posted in Dutch but if you do get a job you won’t have problems living in NL and buying groceries / paying utilities bills speaking English only. /r/immigration is protesting Reddit's API changes. If the region is not for you there is alot of jobs available in the Netherlands so have fun choosing your pick. Sc in psychology and intend to apply for master's in the Netherlands and pursue the PhD path there itself, would you say that after finishing the PhD there's a good chance of finding a sponsored job in the research field or is that very scarce as well. I will graduate in early May 2021. A little warning: Over a period of 16 weeks you're not allowed to work more than 48 hrs per week on average. New. I'm just curious about the job opportunities in the Netherlands after graduation because I've been reading about visa troubles for internationals after graduation which is giving me second thoughts about accepting my offer. Members Online Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. As I am much interested to come to Finland and experience the culture and be a part of it. Pharma jobs in the Netherlands . Terms & Policies Are there any pointers or tips for me to be able to secure a job in the Netherlands? For context, I am a 29 Male, currently working as a Project Manager for an IT Company. Welcome to /r/orangecounty, the Reddit community for all things related to Orange County, California. I have work experience of 8yrs in Supply chain management and freight forwarding. Technische Hoogescholen were still provided academic education for sure, it was just a different system in how education was grouped in institutions. Mainly on Python, perl, linux, docker, jenkins, Posgtresql. Huurwoningen (free premium account for 14 days, best for international students) . While teams may be international, Dutch management prefers conducting meetings in Dutch, even though it's a second native language, for them it is a matter of principle. The one u mentioned poea, owwa, oec are the basics. But it depends where you are applying, since the big tech Some of the most in-demand jobs in the ICT sector include systems administrator, ICT project leader and data engineer jobs. Worst-case: you get a masters degree. Im non eu student and no luck finding part time jobs. So employers are so reluctant to hire me. Greatly increase your chances of finding housing by using RentBird. After I moved, I get messages with job opportunities from Currently, I am employed on a 30hours contract and since I have more free time I decided to search for a second job (30 hours per month again). Be the first to respond to new listings as you get Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. Congrats on your new job. Afarmer would rather have water do work for their farmland sediment disposal etc, shipping companies rather have deep/wide waterways to haul stuff up/down river & canals. Make sure to read the rules before posting to ensure your post is helpful and doesn't get removed. I'm currently looking for job opportunities out of India. People here like to start conversations with “oh, my English is not so good” and proceed to speaking fluent English with extensive vocabulary. I am looking for tips on how to best find a new job in Netherlands since this is the first time i am job hunting in this country and as an expat with very limited Dutch skills my options clearly more limited. I met this guy online who lives is the Netherlands (is a citizen) and I am considering a future there with him. My advice would be: Research all potential European countries and their cost of living and job opportunities, check not only the Netherlands but other countries such as the UK, Nordics etc. 2- How can know more about the job market, which websites, or application should I follow to better understand the market. Hey everyone!! Good day I just to know is it hard to get jobs in Finland as a foreigner. The economy is screwed and the job market is horrible. Assuming I've got a decent portfolio and internship experience and can speak Dutch, is it realistic to think I can find a tech job in the Netherlands, esp. e. Dutch people complain about the trains, but I'm back in Canada for the holidays and I am travelling between two cities of half a million that are about 100 km apart and there is one train per day that takes 2. I have some questions: 1- is it easy to find a job in public health with English language. Find jobs by Explore a vast range of IT jobs in Netherlands - from Java to Python, software development to front-end roles. 720 excluding any bonuses. We're the subreddit for everything Amsterdam, in Dutch or in English. 000 - €7. Please take a look at the sidebar for some tips for getting the most out of it. reddit's new API changes kill third party apps that View community ranking In the Top 1% of largest communities on Reddit. And side by side apply for jobs in Netherlands. what i found surprisingly helpful for learning was alcohol as after a few drinks youre more confident to try out words/sentences you otherwise wouldn't when sober, after a while though this becomes more natural. I've done some reading in this sub-reddit for quite some time and I see a lot of people asking about moving to Holland. Dutch companies, especially for finance are very very Dutch focused. The Netherlands has a long way to go in terms of biotech, so yeah job market isn't great (though there are quite a bit of academic hospitals with computational biology departments, Utrecht and Leiden come to mind). As of Sep 2022 they are all hiring (except for Dsm who are in the middel of a merger). My girlfriend and I are thinking of immigrating to the Netherlands for a number of reasons, and I was interested to hear from electricians who live and work in the Netherlands about what it’s like, what are the requirements, and how the pay compares to the cost of living. I have also directly applied to jobs but again have received no response. CSCareerQuestions protests in solidarity with the developers who made third party reddit apps. Netherlands is a beautiful country. Please browse our FAQ before posting! But what I fear is the job situation in Netherlands. So I have been accepted into the UvA Economics and Business Economics program recently as an international student. But as a US person i think you should focus on short term anyway. A lot of micromanaging, constant conflicts between In the Netherlands in general, the movement around bullshit jobs and basic income is relatively small I guess, to be found exclusively among leftist and highly educated groups. If the company name is present it Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. 3- What should I do to prepare myself for finding a job. There is also a very low change they will hire you indefinetly because if there is a vacancy as an english teacher there will be 10 other people already be waiting for the spot. But once you do a tax return income from all jobs is treated as a single income for taxes and you will get taxes back. Is it easy to land a job? Are there any restrictions for international students? What are the pros and cons of working in the Netherlands? Welcome to r/IWantOut: Reddit's expatriate community. Hi, I'd love to leave the US and the Netherlands is my top option for multiple reasons. Hi there! I just got a job offer from a company in the Netherlands (Amsterdam) for which I would relocate from Germany. And they can prohibit you from taking it, especially in this case as you already work full time and will go over the legally allowed amount. 9 out of 10 times they will sort out your resume based on the lack of education, and in the 10th time you will be competing with people who do have Welcome to the largest bilingual Reddit community for sharing anything related to the Netherlands: news, sports, humor, culture and questions. What speaks for NL: 1) 30% ruling as long as you’re eligible for it, and 2) fluency of English. All my international friends who graduated in the Netherlands found a good job I myself studied interdisciplinary social sciences and I found a job after 6-8 interviews, but many more applications were send. With my two jobs combined I don't make more than 2600€ month which I don't mind what so ever. Join the Study In The Netherlands Discord, here you can chat with other students and use our housing bot. She is PHD in Economics from India. Now, start studying in Germany. I don't want to beat the dead horse to the ground because this has been discussed so many times already - but the differences in salary are by large offset by other expenses such health insurance, retirement funds (which are private), not I understand this, that's why I specified in my other comment that if you meant to ask whether you can find a job higher than your educational level, whether they care about degrees in the Netherlands, then the answer is a hard yes. Identify what your aspirations are and what your current skills and experiences bring. Or check it out in the app stores     TOPICS. nl is a tech job board from Netherlands build with transparency in mind. Huurzone (Free account possible) . From what I hear getting a programming job in the Netherlands is not difficult, and I would meet the criteria for the 30% ruling, so I'm not super worried about heading over to Europe without having a job Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. E. It is our calvinist nature (first suffer, only then get rewarded) which may be related to that. I've met many international students that say "I'm totally willing to learn Dutch". How does NL fare against Germany, France and Switzerland in terms of recruitment ? Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. Best websites for finding student housing in the Netherlands: Kamernet /r/Statistics is going dark from June 12-14th as an act of protest against Reddit's treatment of 3rd party app developers. As such the language and especially terminology being Dutch is very important as mangers will be reluctant to change a whole system and internal processes for 1 person in English. How do I find a job in Finland form different country. Open comment sort options. Delft is a very good university and a master's will put you ahead from all the people doing a bachelor's at a HBO university. 760 - €90. I've already looked at a lot of websites online, and found some interesting options, but I was wondering if you guys have some often used sites that I Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. In the pretty likely case that that's you, just find an Having spoken to Americans who came to NL and other places in Europe, I *highly* doubt that the main reason (not) to go either way is salary. Considering a job and location change towards Netherlands in the next years, and as I work in IT I'm interested what kind of limitation (both for getting hired, and the salary level) will I encounter from not having a Bachelor's degree (only graduated highschool). The people who answer are usually Dutch, but I wondered if it's as easy as proposed by a lot of the dutch Redditors. Well I have just been informed that my contract will not be renewed after the end of the year as such I need to find a new job. . Since you're from outside of the EER, you have to meet certain criteria for a At 20hr/week, I'm not sure if you would be able to find something in SCM, even moreso without Dutch. I am currently living in the United States and am studying to become an electrician. I am looking to get a menial job, I really don't care what it is. I was kind of picky what I applied for, wanting UK cons: London-centric jobs so might be hard to find good jobs outside London, converssely staying in London can be very expensive, intercity rail is a hodge-podge of private operators and not very good, trickier visa/path to citizenship, tenant laws are not very strong, not Schengen+EU I would like to move to Netherlands to start my career. Hows the job market post Msc CS, where all can one get a job, country, city etc. I'm a recent IT grad expat who loves to code and is eager to kickstart Welcome to the largest bilingual Reddit community for sharing anything related to the Netherlands: news, sports, humor, culture and questions. Work part-time in your field in Germany along side studies, take 3 courses per semester. Because of that, finding a job is hard for me since most of the sites I am finding online are either entirely in Dutch or most of the jobs that I could technically apply to require Dutch knowledge. If it was me I would take the job in Netherlands and settle/grow there than coming to US. See rules for more information. My current search is mostly on linkedIn and I would love to hear from devs who moved out after finding job from India. Being very artistic and into alternative medicine will also not help since jobs in these professions are slim picking in the Netherlands. Nearly 100% of the work you do will be in Dutch for Dutch. having a 'nederlands In my opinion and experience it's pretty easy to get a part time job in the Netherlands even without knowing any Dutch. They are offering me a 3-month-contract, to be followed by 6 months, to be followed by 12 months. They usually have shitty jobs (like warehouse work) but they accommodate foreign student and are flexible. I've met 0 international students that are willing to put in any actual effort, and then just complain that the Dutch will often speak English to them. Please browse our FAQ before posting! Members Online View community ranking In the Top 1% of largest communities on Reddit. If you work two jobs at a time, you have to pick the most earning one to have the best deal. Mostly those posts consist of people not speaking any dutch and wanting to aply to a minimumwage job. (I have experience as a bartender, barista, waiter, factory worker, call-center agent). I want to work here after finishing my degree. Reddit iOS Reddit Android Reddit Premium About Reddit Advertise Blog Careers Press. Do you have experience elsewhere? Everything is relative. Part time jobs . Im a chemical engineer in the netherlands and i'd say the job market here is pretty good. I have been contacting recruiters and top international companies in the Netherlands on LinkedIn and some other job search websites but have not received any response. I read some posts about finding jobs in the Netherlands as a software developer, but nothing There’s a major shortage of IT personnel in the Netherlands, so don’t be surprised if someone The job market is definitely not bad. Get a role and see whether you like netherlands and the whole working The job market for tech professionals in the Netherlands is quite strong, with many tech companies and startups based in the country. Goal mo lang is makalabas ng bansa. Only requirement is that you ofc have to do the annual tax filing to get your taxes back. Hi Reddit! I'm currently looking for work in Enschede, since I am moving there from Norway at the start of next year (jan / feb). I'm "doing" the normal taxes on my main job but really thought that this second job would do it by itself as well. I come from a non-EU country and I hear that jobs are hard to come by for us. I was in your shoes and made a mistake of falling into US trap. Judging by your Reddit activity, you sound Lab jobs require at least a master’s degree, and a PhD if you want a better job within that, such as being a researcher (the good thing is, the ladder doesn’t require fluency in Dutch). Controversial. I currently have a job in retail, and have been looking for a job that offers sponsorship for about 6 months now, but sadly to no avail. 6 months of experience is enough or it could backfire? Having 6 months of experience may make it more difficult to find a job compared to someone with more experience, but it is not necessarily a dealbreaker. Both are huge - tax is self-explanatory, the latter means you can live your normal life without speaking a word of Dutch (dealing with authorities, neighbours, utilities, contractors, etc). Or check it out in the app stores     TOPICS I have two IT & data analysis internships with Boeing and have a job offer for Boeing. hardware assembly, repairs), In the Netherlands you can ask "loonheffingskorting" for one job at a time. Best. Best case: you get a masters degree and a job in Netherlands. Without naming names, look for a job in Eindhoven. Hello, I am a public health master student. If this is your first time here, read our Wiki and use our sticky threads. any suggestions or websites where I can look for one ? Or anything that I should be aware of while considering a job to take . For a European country they have a very strong industry with a Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. You should also take into account that she is quite old which puts her in a disadvantage. Please take a look at our resources for detailed information for (international) students: Checklist for international students coming to the Netherlands. Wil her degree considered for a job in a university in Netherlands? It would be really great if someone could connect with me and help to guide her career path. Find jobs for English speakers, with visa sponsorship. My question is, in my second job payslip's appears that I'm only discounting something around 1€ for 16hours of work. I just think it's interesting how the University of Groningen was the first the give out engineering degrees as a university rather than a Hoogeschool. I was wondering if any one had any idea of the current situation with non-EU citizens. All in all, I strongly advise against come to this country if you don’t have a job and a house. English is my native language. Please browse our FAQ before posting! I don't know whether it will be easy for you to find a job here in the Netherlands. Calling on the help of the great Reddit community! Share Add a Comment. Almost a year ago, I got a job which turned out to be quite terrible. Top. pin that pdf in a browser tab and every now and then when you search for a job located in the Netherlands, check if company name is listed in that pdf. The jobs that don't require working experience and don't require fluent Dutch don't accept NON-EU. It's not 2000 anymore where companies offer you a job and a lease car before you even graduated, but it should not be hard at all to get a job at one of the bigger well known companies. It will count the lowest tax bracket with the income you have. Q&A. Furthermore, content and discussions should contain topics concerning daily life in the Netherlands. And expensive, lol. In the Public Administration sector, the Netherlands is hunting for Special Enforcement Booking. Reply reply Welcome to /r/Netherlands! Only English should be used for posts and comments. It does not matter if you have 1 job that pays 40k, or 2 jobs that pay 20k or 4 jobs that pay 10k, you are taxed the same in the end. During the interview you can dive more specific in what you are looking for. Remote - United States I read some posts about finding jobs in the Netherlands as a software developer, but nothing too recent that could satisfy my curiosity. Any recommended websites?, or places in enschede I don't speak dutch, But i do speak fluent chinese. r/Netherlands • Student debts go up with 2. Probably should have made that more clear. I have gotten accepted into two unis at Netherlands, Tillburg University and Maastricht university. and if i understand correctly, bonuses aren’t common in the netherlands. Over 6 months I've been looking for a relocation to the Netherlands but I am not able to grab any visa sponsored jobs or even interview calls. Background: I am Italian, can perfectly speak English (bilingual), spent two years studying Computer Science at the University before having spent one year working for a company as a Full Stack Developer (so I do not have a Bachelor Degree on A community intended to provide a place for users wanting to ask questions, create discussions, post job listings or put themselves out there for hiring, all related to the UK and jobs within the UK. Hi everyone! When I was looking for a job before coming to the Netherlands, I would barely get invited to interviews and it took around 3-4 months to find a job. I was wondering what the job prospects are for international students upon graduating from university. that’s still a fraction of what i make, before my bonus. You have to find the internship yourself, so you can either do it in your own country or in the Netherlands if you speak fluent Dutch. 5%, rents go up with 5%, tax on View community ranking In the Top 5% of largest communities on Reddit. Starting your career in the Netherlands is all about finding the right job — but how do you know where to look? Whether you’re considering making the move to the country or have already made it your home, you likely know Hi expats! How did you find a job in NL as a non Dutch speaker? What tips or resources can Job. Terms & Policies This is just anecdotal evidence but I have enough friends applied for DS jobs in the Netherlands (I'm based in a neighbouring country) as well as here and found more luck there. Also, New Reddit sucks. Amsterdam? Get the Reddit app Scan this QR code to download the app now. which are the major companies that are prevalent in cities such as Eindhoven, amsterdam etc. I do not have any IT knowledge as I graduated with a Business Degree. My current field of expertise is related with customs brokerage (couriers like UPS, Fedex or DHL but also customs agencies), i'am also available to be working in different fields like informatics related (e. Another thing that makes it hard for me to find a job is that I live in a village. Hey Reddit community! I'm seeking some valuable insights from tech professionals living and working in the Netherlands. I'm also interested in knowing how you handle the cost of living and if saving money is feasible. Well, the tech pay in europe/the netherlands just isn't quite up to par with the USA for example. InfoSec jobs are all over the Netherlands. Director of Corporate Technology, Enterprise Applications. This rule is in place to ensure that an ample audience can freely discuss life in the Netherlands under a widely-spoken common tongue. Hey fellow Redditors, I hope you're all doing well! I'm reaching out to this community today because I'm on the lookout for some guidance and advice. Applying for Tech related jobs in Netherlands . I am on the verge of losing the life I have been building here for 9 years, my girlfriend and all my friends. Diploma and tor na translated and certified is part na nung visa process mo obviously. Amsterdam, Mokum, the capital of the Netherlands. This has to be the plot of a Family Guy episode, I can literally hear Peter Griffin explaining it in my head! and almost see the cutaway. g. Hi All Im 37 and thinking to join thuisbezorgd in Tilburg area and use my own ebike, im looking for any info, pros and cons, clothing, google map, driver app, dangers they may be, anything anyone can give me about how it works, whats the salary and how much you earn a month, and would you recommend it as a full time job. HousingAnywhere (Short stays) . I’ve been hitting LinkedIn really hard, doing about 20-30 applications a day (easyApply and company forms). Internet Culture (Viral) Amazing DevITjobs. I was wondering if someone could help me out regarding applying for/getting a job in the Netherlands. Without this you are limited to your expat community. Yeah the water board makes quite sense when you think about it, Netherlands is extremely dense populated and scattered with farms. I saw there are plenty of companies and has less applicants, but my application from LinkedIn never got any response. You are obligated to inform your employer about your second job. I wish to do a part time job with my college . Often permission is required from your employer to work elsewhere. com. You could check job hunting websites such as Indeed to see which cities offer more English speaking positions and hunt for housing and a job from there. anecdotally, some of the jobs in my field pay about 35-50k in the netherlands. I'm finishing my bachelor's degree and I'd love to come over immediately after. The Netherlands is leaning towards "the Netherlands for Dutch," especially after recent votes favoring the right party, which holds an anti-immigrant view. green cards, raids, deportations, etc. I've seen people literally dropping their pens in the middle of meetings at 5pm and relatively junior engineers telling their manager they couldn't make a meeting in the morning because hey had a tennis match scheduled. Every company has to include salary brackets, technology breakdown, and development methodologies in their I don't want to turn down your hopes, but don't expect for her to find a well paying job. These are points I need help : I lived in the Netherlands the past year, I'd say probably go with the Netherlands because of higher take-home pay (30% tax rule), cheaper rent, better rent regulations, easier finding apartments, better public transport, and it's in mainland Europe so you can hop on a train to Paris or Berlin whenever you like. If both jobs together let you stay in the look lowest bracket, you will get your money back at tax-time. Furthermore, content and discussions should concern topics concerning daily life in the Netherlands. Philhealth and sss din cguro but u can do this even abroad. I have 6+ years of experience as full stack developer and after all the analysis I have decided to look job in Netherlands and Germany. Love to travel? Well, you’ll probably have a desk job, but it Vacancies and jobs in IT & Technology in English for expats in the Netherlands. I was wondering if I will have to pay higher taxes even if my annual income is still going to be very low and I won't work more than 60 hours per month which is still counted as a part-time job Only English should be used for posts and comments. after taxes, the company is paying 70-100k for me to work there. NET job, the pay usually maxes out in the €6. Get the Reddit app Scan this QR code to download the app now. 000 a month before taxes, which amounts to a yearly gross pay of €77. I work as a cook in a restaurant (the food is based on fast preparing in a pan) for around 20 or more hours a week and still manage to study. I want to find a software engineering job in the Netherlands. well i was lucky enough to find a place in a student house with mainly dutchies, so being immersed in the language and culture was very easy. Seeking Entry-Level English IT Jobs in Netherlands . I did a bachelor in chemical engineering and the last part of this is an internship at a company. I am currently pursuing a Masters degree in CS in the Netherlands and was wondering about the overall tech scene in and around the Netherlands i. Welcome to r/IWantOut: Reddit's expatriate community. You employer will typically grant you permission unless it's a job at a competitor or can interfere with your job. Welcome to the largest bilingual Reddit community for sharing anything related to the Netherlands: news, sports, humor, culture and questions. Stay close to the Dutch border. That Companies usually prefer Hope you guys can give me a few tips, i'm looking for trustworthy Recruitment Agencies in The Netherlands, any part of the country. The only issue is that in order to get the Visa required I must find a suitable job, but I do not know how many jobs are available to students who complete their Masters in Netherlands. 5 hours and this is one of the best places in the country for transit, in most places there would be no option other Dear reddit, I recently finished my masters studies in the Netherlands and I am actively applying and looking for a job, without success. View community ranking In the Top 1% of largest communities on Reddit. _This community will not grant access requests during the protest. You could still find jobs in cafes or, the easiest but least pleasant solution (in my experience), using flexwork companies. The following will definitely hire non-Dutch speakers: Companies like Thuisbezorgd, Uber eats, Deliveroo, Dominos, New York Pizza are great for delivery job on bikes/scooters. My wife and I will move to Netherlands and I would like to know specially from people in Academia what are the jobs prospects there for my wife. reddit Seconding this one for sure! English + “random other native language that isn’t English or Dutch” will be a boon for sure because shipping does business everywhere and while English is the norm, knowing more languages gives you an edge with that customer base. The closest cities to me are 's-Hertogenbosch and Tilburg. eiii nekscl txrsv sprea vpsy oar gulrm qdoareb lqyy meopur